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  • chanduv23
    09-04 08:06 AM
    Please stop this unnecessary useless discussion here. And I am not "_truefacts". Folks, just like how u do IT or medicine, for politicians - politics is a career. They do whatever they can to be in power and in developing countries like India where unfortunately, corrpution still exists. Corrpution exists everywhere in different forms. Don't we all pay for EAD and AP every year because our country is retrogressed? Don't we all pay for MTR when we do everything based on law?

    One has to accpept the reality and live with it and try to bring about the change within one's parameters.

    People can argue just for the sake of arguements - but the reality is that we are all in it together. If there is an issue that affects all of us, it affects all of us - period. We can argue and counter argue but unless we all get on the same page and understand that there needs to be a solution rather than trask talk, things are not going to change for us.

    Lets concentrate on what we are in this organization for.

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  • dummgelauft
    06-24 01:39 PM
    This is what I received from a immigration lawyer ......


    There are few things that clearly demonstrate the overarching need for immigration reform than the most recent information provided by the U.S. Department of State's (DOS) Visa Bulletin. The Visa Bulletin provides information on the availability of immigrant visa numbers, which dictates when foreign nationals may apply for green cards under various preference categories. The July installment of the Visa Bulletin shows complete unavailability for the vast majority of employment-based cases. Moreover, DOS projections show that demand for higher-preference green card categories could reach record levels, which would lead to backlogs in these categories where green card numbers were traditionally available in the past.

    The Visa Bulletin establishes "cut-off" dates based on the demand for green cards versus the amount actually available under immigration law to each specific employment-based (and family-based) category per country for each fiscal year. As it assesses green card demand in relation to availability, the DOS may move these cut-off dates forward or back, or not at all. When the DOS believes that all immigrant visa numbers in a particular category will be exhausted (or allocated) by the end of a particular fiscal year (i.e., September 30th), it will indicate an "unavailability" of numbers (marked as "U") in the Visa Bulletin. The law prevents any single country from overuse of immigrant visa numbers during a particular fiscal year. As a result, foreign nationals born in countries from which there is significant immigration to the U.S. will typically have a separate "cut-off" date (and longer waiting times for an available green card number) in the Visa Bulletin.

    An individual's priority date or "place in line" for a visa number under the employment-based categories is the date on which his or her employer files a labor certification or immigrant visa petition with the government. Individuals assigned priority dates that are earlier than the relevant preference category cut-off date noted in the Visa Bulletin are eligible to move to the last step in the employment-based green card process - either processing of an adjustment of status application with United States Citizenship and Immigration Services (USCIS), or processing of an immigrant visa at a U.S. consulate abroad. When the category is "unavailable," individuals cannot file for adjustment of status or receive an immigrant visa.

    In the most recent Visa Bulletin, immigrant visa numbers continue to be unavailable for all third preference (EB-3) employment-based cases. Third preference cases comprise the majority of pending employment-based green card cases, as they include positions requiring at minimum either a bachelor's degree or two years of work experience.

    The July Visa Bulletin indicates that the first, second and fourth and fifth preference employment categories remain current for July. However, since demand in the second. preference category for individuals from China and India exceeds the per-country limitations, these two countries have second-preference cut-off dates of January 2000.

    Overall, the July Visa Bulletin continues a substantial decrease in green card availability over the government's 2009 fiscal year. Admittedly, the retrogression, or backward movement of the cut-off dates, has been more common for employment-based green card numbers in recent years. Yet the complete exhaustion of EB-3 numbers and the sharp decline in India and China's EB-2 numbers are staggering reversals given the slow yet steady improvement in these cut-off dates during the present fiscal year.

    DOS has projected that, as a result of significant filings in the EB-4 and EB-5 categories, there will be fewer numbers to supplement the EB-1 and EB-2 categories. In previous years, thousands of unused EB-4 and EB-5 numbers "spilled over" into other preference categories. However, greater-than-anticipated EB-4 and EB-5 usage, as well as greater demand in the EB-1 category itself, will create an even greater dearth of available "spill over" immigrant visa numbers in the EB-2 category.

    In addition, the DOS has indicated that the EB-1 category for individuals born in India or China may backlog or retrogress later this summer, and may do so again in the coming fiscal year. Predictably, prognostications for the EB-2 category for India and China are also quite grim - in the next month or two, the EB-2 category could become unavailable. In particular, USCIS has indicated that it has about 25,000 EB-2 India cases and "significant numbers" of cases for Chinese nationals that have been reviewed and are simply awaiting visa number availability. This category has a typical fiscal-year limit of 2,800, plus any remaining numbers from the EB-1, EB-4 and EB-5 categories.

    With respect to the EB-3 category, the DOS has stated that the worldwide, China and Mexico quotas for the EB-3 category will become available again with the start of the new fiscal year in October 2009, with a projected cut-off date of March 1, 2003 for each. However, the EB-3 India quota may have a November 1, 2001 cut-off date.

    The federal quotas limiting employment-based green card numbers have remained unchanged since 1990, nearly two decades ago. Since that time, the United States has undergone unprecedented expansion, technological development, and cultural diversification, in large part through immigration. During this progress, skilled immigrants have continued one of our country's oldest and proudest traditions - the search for better lives for their families, and the desire to contribute to and to participate in our free society. Still, these quotas remain stagnant, potentially stifling the future of our nation's ability in the 21st century to prosper as an economic competitor in our world, to build a broad-based infrastructure in our localities, and to live together as families in our homes.

    A quarter-century prior to 1990, major revisions to the immigration quotas sparked a historic influx of individuals to our nation of immigrants. In 1965, this broad-based increase in immigration levels across all preference categories allowed some of the world's most talented individuals to come to our shores and share their knowledge as academics, increase our economic fortunes as innovators and entrepreneurs, build vibrant communities as leaders and organizers, and inspire with their tales of strife and triumph as refugees. For many ethnicities and nationalities, the "post-65" generation was the real beginning of their stories in America.

    Faced with a major financial downturn and an increasingly competitive global economy, our country cannot choose the path of closed borders and restricted immigration. At this very moment, historically restrictive nations are expanding their immigration policies and attracting valuable immigrants otherwise bound for our shores.

    Absent relief provided by potential legislation, there will be substantial backlogs for nationals of India and China in all categories for many years. Careful and strategic planning for employers and foreign nationals entering into or engaged in the immigrant visa process will be necessary while we continue to advocate zealously for reform to address these antiquated quotas.

    These green card backlogs illustrate the need for comprehensive immigration reform. In particular, a long-overdue increase in employment-based green card availability would play a major role in making future generations of individuals feel welcome to come to our nation of immigrants and in spurring sorely needed innovation and prosperity.

    ..I am waiting for the punch line. What's the point of this? We all know it...

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  • JazzByTheBay
    05-04 02:41 AM
    This discussion is way off topic for this forum.

    A nation has responsibility (to the extent possible in case of those not residing within its borders) for protecting its citizens.

    Once you give up the citizenship of your country of origin, your allegiance, and therefore the expectation of "protection", should be towards and from the country of your citizenship, not from a "foreign government".


    Tomorrow if we or our generations are getting killed in the US, would you say the same thing. Now do you understand why the country needs to care about its people no matter where they are.

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  • yabadaba
    07-11 09:33 PM
    jazz and others did u give ur ielts..if so where???

    is it reqd ?

    can i submit a 8 yr old copy of my toefl instead?


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  • pravarupa
    07-14 09:33 AM
    My Priority date is Jan 2006, EB2-India category having approved I-140. My husband is in EB3-India having pd Jan'2004, already applied I-485 (140 is approved) and got his EAD and AP. He is already using his EAD. I am a dependent in his I-485 but did not use my EAD and still continuing on H1-B.

    Since my case is EB2-India which is going to be current in August'2008. Am I eligible to apply for I-485 me being the primary and my husband being my dependent? If so would there be any problem when USCIS adjudicates my case?

    Will there be any movement for EB3-India in the coming year?

    Your valuable response is highly appreciated.

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  • dvb123
    09-14 03:07 PM
    1. I-140 premium processing will increase ROW applications
    2. 29 months opt is causing ROW applicants to bypass
    H1-B and go for GC directly
    3. Due to pre-adjudication Labor substitution applicants with substituted priority dates are in frontline
    4. Porting from EB3 to EB2 is being done for atleast 10% EB3 applicants with recapture of priority date
    5. Perm was introduced in early 2005 and lot of EB2 applications labors were approved in 2005

    Hence EB2 will not cross 2005. If it crosses it will come back in a month.


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  • unitednations
    02-14 04:00 PM
    The entire discussion by EB3-ROW guys want to preserve those recaptured unused numbers in 2000 only for EB3-ROW for ever. As I mentioned earlier, the purpose of that recapture is to eliminate backlog in 1999. India and China were only the two countries backlogged at that point. USCIS could do that job only in 2005. You guys want a controlled allocation of recaptured numbers for years and years with the simple intension of EB3-ROW always should be current. I understand that urge. However, you guys forget the reality. EB3 demand is huge due to 245i. The real demand for EB2 always very less. (The real demand for EB2 is when EB3 were current). Now everyone is going to EB2. I feel that is the reason why EB2-India and China getting penalized as DOS took the law in their own hand. Now EB2 guys are victimized. Do not blame India and China took more numbers. The real fact is EB3-ROW is enjoying with the expense of EB2.

    Furthermore all this mess is due cumulative results allowing 245i without increasing visa numbers (this is major one), failure of DOL in processing LC in time, USCIS inefficiency, dealy in processing 485 due to 911, abuse in labor substitution, abuse of massive filing of GC by body shoppers with out a bonafide permanent positions or ability to pay, opening a firms in fast labor processing states just to file GC etc. The list for this mess is end less. No one wants to fix that. If they fix everything, there will be less demand for EB3 visas. Furthermore some thing can not be fixed. One can not request/litigate DOL or USCIS to process the LC or 485 fast. Therefore, everyone in EB3 has to wait. Other option is to educate the law makers the problems due to this mess to fix those. Everyone wants CIR/SKIL bill and no one wants to fix the current system and abuse. So, one has to wait, wait, wait..

    I have come across many people in the last few years from all sorts of countries. Russian, Korean, African, British, Brazilian, Colombian, etc,; although everyone wants their greencards yesterday; it appears to me that the indian nationals are the most hungry for it. It is a generalization but I am just speaking from my experience on this.

    How do you know what the "intention" was of the lawmakers that recaptured visas are supposed to go to the retrogressed countries. If that was the case they would have gotten rid of the 7% limitation along with the recapture.

    Most people who come on h-1b are Chines and indian. There was also close to 200,000 visitor visas approved in 2005 from India. Makes sense because there is a lot of population there. However; it would be short sited to think that there are minimal 245i applicants from India. There actually is a very large number of them. The biggest status violators are people who come on visitor visas from non visa waiver countries. The status violators either get greencard through marriage or through 245i.

    Although as a business person I look at skill rather then nationality; I do know enough about immigration that there is a good purpose behind country limits. Foreign nationals will prefer their own people for h-1b; they will look for their friends, cousins, brothers, sisters, wives, relatives, etc. and bring their own country people here. Therefore, it is not an "open market" on skill people from all parts of the world. The country quota is the equalizer because of this.

    The cultural aspect of south asians is also hurting retrogression. Most people who come here on H-1b are out of school and generally single. People from non south asian countries or muslim countries will find their spouse here. However, someone on h-1b from south asian country or muslim country will get arranged marriage after being here for 4 to 6 years and then spouse gets counted against the quota at the expense of a skilled worker who may have had a later date. I a m not saying this is wrong because it is a cultural issue but is confined to certain countries.

    Regarding eb2 and eb3. This is also something that is quite comical. This is an area where immigration law hasn't kept up business practices. Pre H-1b you got greencard upon initial entry into USA. Department of labor rules were that you couldn't use the experience gained by your sponsor. It was never envisioned that people would come here on h-1b and hop/skip between employers. It has caused an end run around what the DOL rules were supposed to be. You shouldn't be able to gain experience in USA and then use that unfair advantage to knock out an american for that job. EB2 and EB3 differentiation would go away if you couldn't use the experience gained in USA. Just about everyone would be in eb3. Anyone who is here on h-1b generally already has or will have 5 years of experience and can go right to eb2.

    People who are working at companies which aren't dominated by immigrants would have a difficult time satisfying themselves that the job requires a bachelors degree plus five years or masters degree. However; if you work at a staffing company you go straight to eb2 because that is what is needed to keep you there (remember, it is supposed to be the minimum requirements for the job). If software engineer or programmer analyst minimum requirement is masters or bachelors plus five then company is saying that is the "minimum" job requirements. However, if it is the "minimum" requirements then how are companies getting people here on h-1b who only have a bachelors degree?

    Although people like to say "immigration system is broken" it can mean two things. From greencard wannabes; it is too much red tape, not friendly enough, etc. From other side it is broken because it is not being used as its intended purpose. You can mark my words that if/when rules are relaxed on h-1b or quota; you will see a whole bunch of enforcement with it. It actually is already happening at the consulates; department of labor and revocations of 140's by companies who are sponsoring too many people.

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  • bfadlia
    02-19 03:09 PM
    You have to look at the context in which my comments were made. Somebody said that H4 spouses go to college and pay instate fees but they have to pay international fees. I never said that ROW people do not have any of those problems but it just that we have to endure that for some more years. Having said that, I reiterate that I want my GC fast but not at the expense of ROW people. They do not have to endure a longer wait.

    I thought this thread was given a decent burial, I could trust only you to bring this thread back to life with your hidden agenda of driving a wedge between Indians/Chinese and ROW.

    NKR, you said u r replying to someone else.. i don't know why u then quoted me in ur message and in the end added that I didn't care about u.. is it normal that we run down each other for no reason.. what bad thing did i ever say about u..
    sorry that u got the impression the thread was dead, i was away (soccer then resting u know) and came back to see someone else left me hate/curse messages, and speaking on IV's behalf and no one cared to tell him that both acts were not appropriate.. tell me why is it that u (and may be others) agree that removing the country limit is wrong and that saying some nationality is better and brighter than others is also wrong yet not one is defending me when i make those same arguments and get insulted in the process..


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  • bobby
    07-04 12:51 PM
    My suggestions:
    "Door slams shut for highly skilled LEGAL immigrants in the US"
    "US closes the door for highly skilled LEGAL immigrants"
    "US isolates highly skilled legal immigrants"
    "Broken Legal immigration system harmful to US competitiveness"
    "Legal Immigration system in shambles"

    I had started working on a letter myself but will wait for's my initial scribbles fyi....

    Law abiding skilled legal immigrants persecuted by government misstep

    On 7/2/07 the door was slammed shut for many skilled legal immigrants without notice while only 2 weeks earlier these same legal immigrants had been notified that the final stage of their immigration i.e.: green card processing, could begin. This occurred not because these legal immigrants had not followed the rules but rather due to scandalous government actions. These actions have caused outrage & devastation amongst skilled legal immigrants and immigration attorneys alike who question the government�s credibility and the government�s disregard for precedent and the law. The results may be costly litigation and a class action lawsuit by the governing body, the American Immigration Lawyers Association against the government.

    Much focus has been placed on illegal immigrants in this country. Yet, the broken immigration system holds ominous consequences for skilled legal immigrants which the US needs to remain competitive and at the forefront of technological and medical development. The obsolete immigration laws do not address this need and government missteps further contribute to the persecution of law abiding skilled legal immigrants who wait patiently in line and live with severe restrictions for many years while their immigration cases are processed.

    ....I was going to continue with information on the visa bulleting and IV etc.....

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  • breddy2000
    09-03 09:13 PM
    Comparing Ted Kennedy and YSR..not a sane mind would do.

    Amassing money in the name of fictitious projects is dynamic?
    Relentless swindling of money by the parties, leaders, ministers and bureaucrats is dynamic?
    Mobilizing and supplying huge money to prove your royalty to party in Delhi is dynamism?

    If that is the case then Manmohan Singh, Abdul Kalam what are they…they had every chance and more why don’t we speak about them the same way. Show me one personal allegation on Manmohan or Abdul Kalam.

    Yes, it is dynamism to stay in power and to mint money and for people like you…not for administration.

    Any one speaking against, has to deal with personal abuse, that’s even with opposition MLA’s. What happened to democracy?

    Since 60 years Congress has ruined India and people like Sonia and YSR are few examples of corrupt politics and YSR is openly involved. YSR is no different to a dictator.

    Corruption rampant in AP under YSR's regime ( � YSR’s new low (
    The Hindu : Andhra Pradesh News : YSR a champion of corruption: Chiru (
    YSR the most corrupt politician - Telugu Movies - Zimbio (
    Naidu to approach Centre on YSR’s ‘Satyam route of corruption’ (

    One can write a book on YSR’s corruption. AP has become worse than Bihar.

    Majority of politicians in India are corrupt . Why single out one ...Does it give you solace to ridicule someone who is dead....

    I'm not a supporter of any political leader or party and you cannot create one politician that satisfies every citizen of its nation. And that's a simple fact. As long as the vast majority of the population is satisfied with the party administration and get some real benefits out it, that's what I call a real political leader and I see YSR as one among them...

    If you really want to vent out your frustration, just go to India and do something about it. Why not change the things the way they are... Its easier said than done ...Don't you think??

    Looks like you created your ID yesterday , just to vent out your frustration. Maybe you are one of the Senior Members who wish to hide your identity just for the sake...

    Get a Life Man....


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  • jhaalaa
    01-13 01:21 PM
    Long 19 page memo - but loud and clear for many scenarios -

    USCIS posts Q & A: D&vgnextchannel=68439c7755cb9010VgnVCM10000045f3d6a1 RCRD

    This memo is an eye opener especially for folks on consulting company assignments and those who are self-sponsored or who want to do their own business. Finding a new H1 sponsor would be extremely difficult as well (AC21 folks beware).

    Now getting a new H1 or a transfer or a renewal, may be subject to very stringent scrutiny.

    This memo has the potential to throw a lot of small boutique Consulting companies out of business and along with it many of their employees - whether they use H1 or not.

    Wish the best for all affected folks.
    Pray and hope the GC dream is realized faster for all.

    Best Wishes

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  • arunmohan
    09-23 04:02 PM
    are you sure that 5882 is dead ??? in that case, I agree lets do this on a major scale ...we don't have to say accurately how many people have not bought the house ...lets say 80% of legal high paying immigrants are not buying because they don't have a GC ..(I did not read the prev threads in detail ..but I guess we need to include everyone ..and not just those who have not yet taken the plunge that is more realistic) ....

    I would suggest to everyone to pass this information to your freinds too. We need to do it on massive way.

    Sending an email is not going to create any problem just a 2-3 minutes job.

    I am sending to all my 40-60 friends.


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  • rahulpaper
    06-26 08:33 PM
    Ok, if the Fragomen page is the source of this rumor: can someone who is a Fragomen client ask their attorney about what's going on here. That might help clarify things a bit. (Given that they are the largest immigration law firm, there's bound to be many IV members for whom Fragomen is preparing documents.)

    Please Please Please ask the lawyer you are working with.....

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  • sanjay
    10-15 03:50 PM
    proengineer why did you create a new profile to post this?
    Why are you marketing a lawyer?

    Atleast he had something to tell. He might had spent atleast half an hour or more to get these numbers.

    And I think that who ever is on IV for sometime knows about Ron, Gerg, murty and OH . So what's the big deal ?


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  • actaccord
    01-13 10:10 PM
    to some of your points, but
    is the response from amitjoey not enough to understand why PlainSpeak's view won't work ?

    amitjoey response is good, correct, to the point and more civil than any one else. As you said there are more silent readers who if don't see amitjoey's response will consider IV is trying to do something wrong by harsh response (through their senior members/donors). Just read all comments except amitjoey's the thread will give different view (-ve to IV forum).

    When some one reads uncivilized comments they don't just think bad about the person but also get -ve impression about the forum. You are missing important point, just because some one wants to give comments so that silent readers find abt people like plainspeak/gcperm but in reality it works just against the forum nothing else.

    And when we want to create a professional forum for a reason/cause, as a forum member we need to maintain some professionalism in our comments. If anyone find any thread is not appropriate respond perfectly like amitjoey or report it to moderator.

    As a new member (joined just 2008 and read only reasonable threads) I never know someone GCPerm and anything about his/her good/bad threads. So, it doesn't add any value if senior members fighting on who is who.

    I am speaking for benefit of this forum which will benefit every person who join/participate. But if a member doesn't bother or care about what kind of -ve impression they are leaving then what is the real benefit of having that member. Just because that member don't care about having more members doesn't reflect the forum core members view.

    You don't agree to my views but your response is nice and civilized and that is what I am talking about. I would say amitjoey's way of response (so do your response to my comment) would help both PlainSpeak and every members who reads the thread to understand what is good/bad for us as group.

    One thing I disagree is your rough reality, in the name of rough reality we don't have to write rough wording in a forum where we need more people to join for a cause. You may not want any more member but I don't think that could be the case with IV core members. Why, mostly (not all) people who are in this forum will stop working for the forum after getting GC and we always need new members (may be 1 in 10000) who will add value to the forum.

    And I haven't responded to PlainSpeak because I have no knowledge about that topic and I am still understanding/learning it. Also amitjoey's response is more than enough which is civilized and perfect (at least to me). Unless I have something to add to his point I can just keep quiet instead of leaving -ve impression abt the forum.

    For any cause as a group we can fight with violence (uncivilized) and without violence (civilized). There is always people for both approach, but as a forum member we need to follow the core members way rather than our own way. And part of user registration we all agree to the terms and one of it is "By agreeing to these rules, you warrant that you will not post any messages that are obscene, vulgar, sexually-oriented, hateful, threatening, or otherwise violative of any laws."

    I had my own experience in this forum about hateful comments towards me by a senior member/donor. But that particular thread got removed because of so much hateful comments. Once we start accepting hateful comments it won't stop at any level and the forum will be filled with hateful comments. If you feel some thread/comment is not good better respond properly or report to moderator. Why we need to fill this forum with hateful comments when we have tools to avoid it.

    actaccord: I also want to see civilized discussion. But that is not possible with people like PlainSpeak/GCPerm. I know this person. He has always tried to create Eb2/Eb3 divide. The problem is not with language of some of the posts you referred as "uncivilized", the problem is that for every post there are hundreds of people silently reading each posts. Each post influences those silent readers. If unanswered snakes like GCPerm can cause a lot of damage.

    In an open anonymous forum you need to develop a thick skin. Person of every strip and belief can post anything. If you cannot handle this, it is better for you to resign from accessing any or all websites.For a period of time, I felt the same way as you did but it does not work that way. Stop this nonsense of political correctness when snakes like GCPerm spit venom to divide everyone.

    A forum is a combination of all sorts of ideas and expression. You may like some and you may not like some. If you or your friends find it so difficult to stand this expression, then please sit quietly in your home because you cannot join hands with anyone in this real and rough world. How long are we going to " try to gain confidence" of more members? How long? I do not want to gain confidence of anyone anymore. If I was to make a decision, I would say that I don't need those members who cannot stand a little bit of rough reality. I am not going to do anything to "gain confidence" of others. If you want to work then good for you. If you don't want to work on the issue affecting your family, then so be it. You are doing a favor to no one but yourself when you speak with your Congressman. So Good luck and Good bye. But don't preach civility to everyone if you cannot first respond to PlainSpeak. I hate this Eb2/Eb3 fight.

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  • Rohan99
    07-27 06:35 PM
    Did you tell that person you are doing illegal work in his country? Is that person from Mexico?

    Run from who? I will see who runs from who? :)
    Sorry to hear that someone lied to you, and it totally shows that person's integrity. But its nothing to do with Amway. Amway never told them to pick u up and take you to the meeting. It was his wrong decision. Probably they are not in business today either.

    My platinum is US army Airborne division...SERVING his country. You saying something?
    Sounds like you know something he doesn't know. Probably he or I should have checked from you.


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  • lskreddy
    04-22 06:36 PM
    Check your messages Suresh. Thanks.

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  • unseenguy
    06-16 01:09 AM
    Outsourcing is bad for not only for US citizens but also for future H1bs and GC aspirants also.
    Still all the jobs cannot be outsourced. Also if that would have been the case I would have been out of job. But My salary was increasing steadily and in this tough economy also I was able to get a new job with 20% rise in pay after I lost job . There are many companies in USA who are only hiring USA citizens and discouraging outsourcing. Wherever I was working I discouraged those companies from outsourcing but encouraged them to hire h1bs ,GC holders or US citizens. Many start up companies in California cannot afford to do outsourcing because of tight release schedules.

    Correct. So based on your post, skilled people need not worry about outsourcing. You can argue in favour of onshoring and that is a good argument. I support this kind of approach.

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  • Macaca
    02-19 10:59 AM
    Now is the time to donate money, a little bit of your time, a little effort to contact your lawmakers....

    You better start donating NOW

    The following meanings are from Meriam-Webster online dictionary (

    Meaning of donate ( to make a gift of; especially : to contribute to a public or charitable cause.

    Meaning of contribute ( to give or supply in common with others <contribute money to a cause>
    a : to give a part to a common fund or store <contribute to a fund-raising campaign>

    b : to play a significant part in bringing about an end or result <many players have contributed to the team's success>

    By giving money to IV you are contributing (= helpting yourself) NOT donating (= helpfing someone else).

    02-14 06:25 AM
    What rights did the Natives have in the 18th and 19th centuries when Europeans invaded their lands, and massacred most of them? Did they respectfully ask the Natives if they could immigrate? No? They walked in as if they owned this land. As a Canadian, I'm ashamed to say that this happened in my country too.

    Never think of immigration as a privilege - think of it as your birthright - this is your planet and you have the right to go wherever you want. Get into that mentality instead of the groveling "Please sir, I want some more" mentality.
    well said. actually there should be corresponding supply of green cards to the demand. as long as jobs are there and people are needed - GC numbers should be increased. but life is never fair - my advice (to those who want) - live life well , try yr best with IV efforts and make as much money as you can(and be ready to move out with it). I think country limits was set in green cards to ensure that not many people come from one country (because they become powerful as their numbers increase and become a voting bloc) - however migration from south changed everything.

    07-21 03:11 PM
    To a_yaja,

    Thanks for your detailed story my friend. This thread is turing into a support group for Amway/Quickstar victims.
    How is your experience with your childhood Amway friend. Still friends or just keeping in touch because he has the acess to the Amway database? :P

    [QUOTE=a_yaja;1971286]I have come across quite a few of the Amway/ Quickstart folks. Like most of the people have described here, they usually approach me in Walmart, Meijer, etc. My first experience was in the temple. This dude and his wife went "oh wow! you know so many languages." After talking to the dude, he said that he knew some of my childhood friends and he remembered my face and that we could have possibly played cricket together in our childhood days (this itself should have raised red flags - but I was naive then and didn't think twice). Long story short, we exchanged phone #s and next day he called me and asked me to meet him at his home. He was running an "ecomm business" and was looking for partners. I asked him if he was talking about Amway and he innocently asked me "What is Amway?" I agreed to meet him but something bothered me. I called up another childhood friend who was in Amway and asked him about this dude. Sure enough he was an Amway-ite and already a "Diamond". I was mad and did not go to his house. He called me a couple of times but I never picked up the phone.


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